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Rep. Agema responds to citizen plea to abandon Islamaphobic legislation

September 19, 2011

After reading the September 3, 2011 GRIID post on HB 4769, Anti-Sharia law legislation proposed by Representative Dave Agema, I decided to email him to voice my objections. As a mother of Muslim-convert son and grandmother of two beautiful Muslim grandsons, I asked him to reconsider his stance as in reality we are in no danger of being subjected to Sharia law here in Michigan. I further related that such legislation only serves to further the Islamaphobia that the nation’s fear-mongers are hoisting on those American folks without an understanding of how our Muslim American neighbors live. In short, I asked him to keep Michigan a safe place for my family. I shared with him that mainstream Islam consider Muslims, Christians and Jews all “People of the Book,” as they consider the Old and New Testaments as holy books as well as their Quran.

Agema emailed me a response.  I forwarded it to my son, Abdul Nur, who converted to Islam some 12 years ago and has studied Islam at schools in Chicago and at the University of Medina, Saudi Arabia.

Agema: My bill has only to do with foreign laws entering our courts that are contradictory to our state or federal laws. As far as “People of the Book,” I have read large portions of the Koran and his prophets sayings that are all adhered to by Muslims. While this is America and we have freedom of religion, much of the Sharia law is anathema to our laws.

Abdul Nur: Part of sharia law is that when a Muslim lives in a foreign land, he agrees to the conditions put out by that land. Muslims in the U.S. don’t want to implement the Islamic Jurisprudence of Sharia; they want to benefit from the domestic rules of Islam such as marriage, divorce, inheritance etc.

Agema: (Under Sharia law) only Muslims will be allowed to carry guns.

Abdul Nur: This is an absurd notion considering my first point.

Agema: Sharia law allows a man to have four wives.

Abdul Nur: If this is a point that is extremely offensive to Christians, understand that most Muslims also don’t want to have multiple wives.

(Abdul Nur further explained that under Sharia law, the parties involved in any marriage must both want to be married, without coercion. I might add that the Quran isn’t the only holy book with polygamist heroes.)

Agema: . . . women have half the rights of a man.

Abdul Nur: This is 100% false. Women don’t have a blanket ‘half the rights of men’ law applied to them. There are some situations where women are given less money than men in inheritance, mainly because men are the providers, more often than not, in Islamic relationships.”

Agema: . . . a man can beat his wives.

Abdul Nur: There is little to no evidence to support such a thing, and the commonly quoted evidence is of a weak nature.

Agema: When a divorce happens the kids go to the father.

Abdul Nur: Not true at all, the child is allowed to choose in most cases which parent he would like to live with.

Agema: Also, if you are a Christian then you can’t abide by their beliefs that Jesus is not the Son of God nor Savior.

Abdul Nur: Good thing we live in America where we have freedom of religion, and separation of church and state, oh wait…”

Agema: Also look up the word “tequia-spelling may be wrong)(sic).  This allows Muslims to lie to Christians (sic) and jews (sic) if it furthers Islam.

Abdul Nur: This Is common amongst Shi’ah Muslims, and is considered an egregious practice amongst orthodox Muslims. It’s quite ironic to hear a politician claiming that our fault in this world is lying to further our benefits.

Agema: Islam means submission. 60% of the Koran and Mohammed’s writings are about how to treat infidels or kafirs.

Abdul Nur: This doesn’t justify any kind of response, and is blatantly untrue. I really doubt anyone took the time to quantify the amount of the Islamic Law pertains to non-Muslim people. Not to mention that in Islamic states, for over 1,000 years, non-Muslim people had rights and the freedom of religion. Something that, unfortunately, cannot be said about most Christian countries.

Agema: They have a right to believe what they want but they don’t have the right to be free from our laws and constitution when they disagree.

Abdul Nur: I agree with this, and I don’t know a single Muslim that wishes to make non-Muslims subjected to Islamic law in this country.

Agema: This bill applies to UN mandates as well and any other law that comes our way that denies someones rights according to our constitution. Most are found  in child custody cases and divorce cases that have crept into our judicials system.

Abdul Nur: What’s wrong with us referring to our beliefs in domestic matters if both parties wish for it to happen? We aren’t trying to make anyone else do it. We just want to live peacefully according to our religion. Should that be against the law?

Agema  also wrote, “When these (Sharia law) enter our courts through progressive judges our justice system is in error and people’s constitutional rights are lost because they used these instead of ours (50 cases in 23 states.”

I looked up this bit of propaganda, which is being disseminated by an extreme right-wing think tank, the Center for Security Policy, a group which Source Watch describes as being part of the Islamaphobia network. The Center for Security Policy invented and disseminated the Ground Zero Mosque hoax and served as major inspiration to Norwegian terrorist, Anders Breivik, who bombed Oslo and murdered 68 people (mostly teenagers) at a youth camp in July 2011.

What is Sharia Law?

According to the Islamic Society of Lansing, the group sponsoring a petition against HB 4769, “Sharia is a Muslim code of conduct, in the same way that the Bible guides Christians with their daily life. Sharia calls on Muslims to engage in daily prayers, give alms to the poor, partake in good deeds, and avoid sin. Sharia is not monolithic. While some elements of Islamic law are central to the faith, other elements are contextual based on time and place.

At no time does Sharia seek to supersede the Constitution or the local laws of the land. Muslims are obligated to abide by the laws of the country in which they reside as long as the country offers religious protection and grants the right to worship freely.

They go on to explain, “The bill does not specifically mention sharia, but as Muslims we feel that the legislation targets us based on its similarity to other “anti-Sharia” laws popping up in other states.

These bills play on the public’s fear of the unknown and capitalize on misinformation in the public discourse about the nature of Sharia. Additionally, the constitutionality of these laws will likely be called into question.”

This writer whole heartedly agrees with The Islamic Society of Greater Lansing summation of the bill.  “HB 4769 does nothing to protect our legal institutions but only contributes to the growing climate of fear mongering against the American Muslim community which marginalizes and casts suspicion upon loyal Americans.”

29 Comments leave one →
  1. kswheeler permalink
    September 19, 2011 7:47 pm

    Stelle, I really appreciate the perspective you bring to this issue, and for continuing to cover the witch hunt against Arabs and Arab-Americans in this country. Thank you.

  2. kswheeler permalink
    September 19, 2011 7:48 pm

    Sorry, I meant to say Muslims and Arab-Americans!

  3. Truth permalink
    September 22, 2011 3:45 am

    Abdul-Nur is lying through his teeth on every response–exactly what one would expect.

    He fails to provide any actual references to the Qur’an or hadith. And he cleverly omitted mentioning the Qur’an-endorsed practice of taqiyya (16.106 [Late Mecca], 3.28-29 [Medina]) that commands Muslims to lie during times of war or under duress. And since the Qur’an is clear that Muslims are ALWAYS at war with non-Muslims (see the Medina chapters), they are not only free to lie, but commanded to do so by their own book.

    See also al Misri’s manual of shari’a law _Reliance of the Traveller_ p. 744-746, which specifies that lying during war is ALWAYS permissible. Lying is also permissible “ . . . if attaining the goal is permissible . . . and obligatory to lie if the goal is obligatory.” Even better is to “employ words that give a misleading impression . . .”.

  4. September 22, 2011 12:17 pm

    If American Muslims truly want to be treated as Americans, they shouldn’t have a problem with America protecting our system of laws from the UNequal system of sharia. If Muslims are being dishonest about sharia, as the Islamic Society of Greater Lansing is, why would they lie unless they support it? Sharia law seeks to be dominant in all countries, and IS the rule of law in Islamic countries. If sharia is not a problem, then WHY is it being used as legal precendent in over 20 states for divorce, etc? In Islamic divorce, the woman has no rights to her children or to monetary support. DO we want this creeping into our own law system nullifying US divorce laws, to name just one example?

  5. September 22, 2011 12:20 pm

    and I also observe that Abdul Nur is lying. But this is okay in Islam if it helps spread Islam to non-muslim countries. Americans should remember this…. there is also no Golden Rule in Middle Eastern culture/Islamic cultural norms, so they don’t feel bad about lying….. their loyalties are to Islam first, their country second. Western thought/norms are very different, so we have a hard time believing that Muslims can lie and not feel bad about it….

  6. SgtTom permalink
    September 22, 2011 1:10 pm

    Why would any American be upset with this law? Finally a representative who understands Islam does not mean “peace” and jihad is not just “a struggle to do God’s work“, as is taught for over a month to our 9th grade World History students here in Michigan’s public schools, mandated by the state and federal governments. They teach lies, change the definitions of words to make more palatable to the stupid “infidels” and indoctrinate our children into the cult they call Islam.

    Thank you Mr. Agema for protecting our Constitution and our State from those which would rather supersede our laws with theirs.

    By the way, Islamaphobic isn’t even a real word, just some made up one to try and “quiet” anyone who says anything negative about Islam.

  7. Truth permalink
    September 22, 2011 1:38 pm

    Abdul-Nur: “We aren’t trying to make anyone else do it.”

    . . . yet, but that is coming:

    “. . . Allah will complete (the revelation of) His Light, even though the Unbelievers may detest (it). It is He Who has sent His Messenger with Guidance and the Religion of Truth, that he may proclaim it over all religion, even though the Pagans may detest (it).”
    Qur’an 61.8-9, Medina

    Abdul-Nur: “We just want to live peacefully according to our religion.”

    Your religion dictates that all must follow your god and your prophet or be killed. THAT is “according to your religion”:

    “ . . . fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war . . . “
    Qur’an 9.4-5, Medina, last surah

  8. Truth permalink
    September 22, 2011 1:48 pm

    The Qur’an teaches that it is based on progressive revelation (17.106 (middle Mecca); 16.101 (late Mecca); 2.106 (Medina); 76.23 (Medina)). This means that whenever a later revelation contradicts an earlier revelation, the later revelation replaces it.

    That is why it is imperative to read the Qur’an in chronological (NOT numerical) order of the chapters. The final revelations—those from Medina—are not at all peaceful.

    Complete listings of the chronological order of the surahs are available on Islamic websites, but the last 5 are: 62, 48, 5, 110, 9 (the last).

    Free ebook versions of the Qur’an in English are available at gutenberg.org, mobi files, or http://www.clay.smith.name/Parallel_Quran.htm and every local library has multiple copies.

    READ THE BOOK!!!

  9. Jay permalink
    September 22, 2011 1:52 pm

    great comments, glad to see some people have their head on straight when it comes to being realistic about Islam and its harmful teachings.

  10. Mark permalink
    September 22, 2011 1:53 pm

    Congratulations to Rep. Dave Agema for knowing the difference between truth and lies (taqiyya). HB4769 is not aimed at Muslims as they claim. It is aimed at protecting our Constitution from any foreign law. Why is it that of all the foreign laws in the world, only Sharia seeks to push its agenda in America? Probably for the same reason that the largest oppostion to this bill, which does not mention Sharia by name, is coming from Muslim Brotherhood front organizations who’s sole goal according to their own documents uncovered in the Holy Land Foundation trial of 2008 is “the process of settlement is a ‘Civilization-Jihadist Process’.
    The Ikhwan must understand that
    their work in America is a kind of grand jihad in eliminating
    and destroying the Western civilization from within and “sabotaging”
    its miserable house by their hands and the hands of
    the believers so that it is eliminated and God’s religion is
    made victorious over all other religions.”
    With motivations like this HB4769 is clearly needed so this agenda cannot seep into our court systems and try to create a precedence of Sharia or any other foreign corrupt law in Michigan.

  11. Jay permalink
    September 22, 2011 2:08 pm

    what about the Muslims hunt to kill people? Why doesn’t stelle instead of defend Islam preach against the ones who reinforce this stereotype. You will get nowhere defending something without first addressing the real problem. How is it offensive if it’s true?

  12. Jeff Smith permalink*
    September 22, 2011 3:18 pm

    I see we have lots of apologists for Rep. Agema and they our touting the same kind of fear mongering(http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2011/08/islamophobia.html) that commercial media has presented for decades and especially since 9/11. I say for decades, because when the Oklahoma Federal building was bombed in 1994, the media experts right away said it was Middle East (meaning Muslim) terrorists, The fact that someone who identified as a Christian did the bombing, didn’t mean that all Christians support terrorism. The fact that most US Presidents say they sought the council of the Almighty to invade/bomb/terrorize poor people in other countries does not mean that all Christians believe this. The fact that Chritian leaders like the Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson and John Hagee preach violence and militarism against other countries doesn’t mean that all Christians embrace violence and militarism.

    Why then do people assume that people who practice Islam that they support terrorism and violence? Of course there are some Muslims who do, just like there are some Christians, Jews and Hindus who support violence, but not people who practice those religious traditions.

    Agema has proposed this legislation because he is an Islamo-phobe, which is not surprising since he has supported numerous legislative pieces that are anti-immigrant, anti-working families and anti-gay.

    To response to the claim that Stelle should, like all Muslims, condemn acts of terrorism in the name of Islam, is not the issue here. However, most Muslim I know condemn acts of terrorism and groups like the Council on American – Islamic Relations has consistently condemned terrorism doesn’t matter to reactionaries. http://www.cair.com/AmericanMuslims/AntiTerrorism.aspx

  13. Truth permalink
    September 22, 2011 5:58 pm

    Jeff–you can’t seriously be that clueless about CAIR. They are the kings of taqiyya.

    Google “Holy Land Foundation Trial”. CAIR is just another front group for the Muslim Brotherhood.

    Even the State Dept lists them as a terrorist group, and the IRS revoked their tax exempt status earlier this year when an investigation into their finances revealed they are a fund-raising organization for Hamas.

    Wake up and READ THE QUR’AN!

  14. Mark permalink
    September 22, 2011 6:43 pm

    Jeff

    Tim McVey was not a Christian. Agema is not anti-immigration, but he is opposed to ILLEGAL immigration and ILLEGAL immigrants who take away the working man’s job from Michigan CITIZENS. Agema is also not anti Gay, however he does oppose Michigan colleges who illegally provide same sex benefits using our tax dollars.

  15. Jeff Smith permalink*
    September 22, 2011 7:08 pm

    Mark, McVeigh did identify as a Christian and was part of the Christian Identify movement. You also don’t respond to my comments about Falwell, Robertson and Hague which promote a Holy War.

    Agema and his apologists can say they are only against undocumented immigrants, but his anti-immigration proposals intimidate and foster fear amongst those who are here with official documentation. The notion that undocumented people take jobs from Michigan citizens is ridiculous. How many people who are not immigrants do you know work doing migrant labor across the state. That argument is old and unfounded.

  16. Jeff Smith permalink*
    September 22, 2011 7:14 pm

    I’d like to respond to you by name, but I won’t call you truth, which would be just too ironic. CAIR is not a front group for the Muslim Brotherhood anymore than I am a member of the Trilateral Commission. I have read the Qur’an and the Christian and Hebrew scriptures and they all have texts that advocate violence and discrimination. All three of these mono-theistic traditions have been used to support slavery, violence, abuse of women, etc……..but that does not mean that all who call themselves Christians, Jews or Muslims believe that. I am very awake and even lucid in my understanding of these issues.

  17. Truth permalink
    September 23, 2011 3:03 am

    Jeff–Have you read the Qur’an in chronological order? Do you understand the principle of abrogation that the Qur’an itself teaches?

    Clearly you have never, ever read anything regarding the HLFT, or their own manual on how to convert the West to Islam (see Sayyid Qutb’s _Milestones_). The FBI investigation into CAIR is explained in detail in _Muslim Mafia_ by Gaubatz and Sperry.

    Everything else you have said is just opinion. Cite some serious sources. Try some facts.

    The uninformed are easy victims of taqiyya.

  18. Jeff Smith permalink*
    September 23, 2011 12:43 pm

    Hey “Truth” (still not willing to share your identity – interesting)……………so, you cite a book by reactionary authors who are part of the anti-Muslim movement. What a surprise. Here are some sources I rely on:

    Islamophobia: The Ideological Campaign Against Muslims, by Stephen Sheehi

    http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2011/08/islamophobia.html

    http://smearcasting.com/

  19. kswheeler permalink
    September 23, 2011 1:23 pm

    The false information posted in this comment thread by the Agema bigots/apologists is really shocking. I can only guess that they have fallen victims to radical-right-wing talk radio, because what they’re saying about taquiyya is nonsense.

    Taquiyya does not COMMAND anyone to lie. It ALLOWS Shi’ite Muslims (and only followers of Shi’a Islam follow this) to conceal their religion when under threat, imprisonment, or when being persecuted for their beliefs.

    If concealing their religion means that they are compelled to break dietary laws, this is forgivable. If it means that they have to openly recant Islam under duress, they are allowed to do so–but ONLYif their lives are in danger or their families under threat.

    Sunni Muslims, the vast majority of the followers of Islam, do not follow this dispensation, which is similar to a Catholic receiving dispensation in confession for acts committed under threat or duress.

    You asked for citations. Verse 16:106 of the Qu’an tells the story of a man named Yasir, a disciple of Muhammad and called one of the Four Companions, who renounced his beliefs in order to end extensive torture. Despite this, he was welcomed into paradise.

    Sunni Muslims believe that if someone “professes unbelief…in order to escape his enemies, no blame falls on him.” But Sunnis believe that martyrdom and death under such circumstances is more honorable.

    Taquiyya was prominently discussed and came into necessary play in Spain during the Inquisition, where Christians viciously attacked, imprisoned, tortured, and executed thousands of Muslims and Jews. Some Muslims chose to pose as Christians in order to protect their families. Some of these Muslims were chastised by Islamic jurists for doing this, because they were using taquiyya as a way of staving off danger, rather than invoking it when directly under attack.

    The bigots here are attempting to use scare tactics to imply that Muslims use this very narrow and conscripted practice in order to carry out terrorist activities. Such people are not considered Muslims within the Islamic faith and Islam would not condone these actions.

    As for Dave Agema, he is a bigot and an extremist. His legislation is just a copycat version of the bills authored by David Yerushalmi, a “think tank” leader who has published anti-Muslim, anti-immigrant, and anti-black materials, and who is, essentially, a neo-Nazi skinhead.

    His anti-immigrant stance extends to a law he sponsored that would allow racial profiling by police, a practice that is currently illegal in Michigan. This legislation even caused objections by business owners who had employees who had been born in other countries and were not White–they announced that they would rather move offices to different states rather than allow their employees to be treated like criminals, as Agema would like to see happen.

    Agema is definitely a homophobic bigot as well. He’s attacked civil marriages for gays, gone after domestic partner benefits, The so-called Christian Agema also sponsored legislation that would force a penalty reduction in state aid to any university that provides domestic partner benefits.

    Agema has claimed that Obama is a Muslim and is working hand-in-glove with extremists to advance Islam over Christianity in the US–with no evidence whatsoever. Agema recently wrote on his Facebook page that “Egyptian TV (NOTE: NO CITATION) says he’s a muslim according to some sources (NO CITATION).”

    You want chapter and verse, but your own Whitey-white bigot in the legislation spreads lies like that without any reference to where he got it, and you people just fall down like slavering dogs and believe every word. Pathetic.

  20. kswheeler permalink
    September 23, 2011 2:07 pm

    Some more Qur’an citiations for taqiyya (I realized in my post above that I used a Western spelling)

    40:28: A man is described as a believe but one who must hide his faith because of the hostility of non-Muslims.

    2:225: Believers are told that Allah will not call anyone into account for their words under duress, but only what is in their hearts.

    3: 54: a passage which describes a group of men hostile to Islam “scheming” to harm Muslims, and that Allah “schemed against them–and Allah is the best of schemers.”

    In the Hadith, there is a passage where it says, “He who makes peace between people by inventing good information or saying good things is not a liar.”

    In Islamic law, there is a passage called “the reliance of the traveler” which says in essence that in foreign and hostile lands, the concealment of religion is a precaution, especially if “the consequences of telling the truth are more damaging.”

    Lying in other circumstances is forbidden. But just like extremists who falsely call themselves Christians and then attack, persecute, and kill under the name of Jesus, there are those who falsely call themselves Muslims and commit atrocities and terrorist activities. These people are no more Muslims than the hatemongers in this country are Christians; just because they say they follow Islam doesn’t mean it’s true.

  21. Edavis permalink
    September 23, 2011 10:02 pm

    Alright,

    I am the one interviewed here, and I would like to reply to some of the people who have posted comments calling me a liar. My responses will be brief but concise.

    1) what about the Muslims hunt to kill people?

    it’s hard to take this seriously, no one likes them, muslims don’t like them, christians don’t like them. I don’t like that our gov’t invaded iraq based on complete lies, but I don’t say all Americans are warmongers becasue it happened. If you wan’t to have a heart filled with hatred that’s your choice. Terrorism is a real problem in the world and, SURPRISE!, it’s not just Muslims commiting it. Norway, Oklahoma City, Virginia Tech University, Columbine etc. etc come to mind.

    2) Concerning lying at a time of war.

    Yes, in an islamic state is is allowed to provide the enemy with false information during a time of war. We have neither an Islamic Army nor an Islamic state. Does the CIA or FBI tell everyone the truth about everything? Obviously not. It’s such a stupid issue to bring up, mainly because Muslims in America are more concerned with paying rent on time then trying to wage war with people.
    The common tactic I see from right wing thought now-a-days is to dehumanize Muslims to justify treating them like animals. This is basically what this train of thought leads to. You are saying because it’s ok for Muslims to lie when in a millitary situation, that all muslims are lying all the time. Doesn’t add up…
    Your reference to “Reliance of the Traveller” is redundant to your first point. Are Muslims at war with the US? No. We live here, we work here, we struggle to find our paths here, and appreciate the freedoms we have.

    3) @Avila, can you tell me any cases in which the woman wasn’t allowed custody of her children based on “sharia law”. If this did happen it is truly outrageous.

    4) Most people quoting the qur’an trying to use it as evidence of the Islamic grand scheme to take over america do so out of context, for instance. The Verse “ . . . fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war . . . “
    In surah 9. is talking about a specific event, in which after 13 years of persecution, Allah allowed war to be waged against the Quraysh, who persecuted, tortured, robbed, and killed the Muslims, and attacked them in their sovereign city of Madinah. For this reason they were attacked.

    I would enjoy more discourse, but less biggoted hate speech. I’m sorry if I didn’t reply to every moot point that you people brought up. And I doubt even if what I say is the truth that you would admit it. I have no reason to lie, and hope the best for all of you, even those who disagree that Muslims are people that deserve to live with the pursuit of liberty and happiness.

    Im a Muslim
    Im a Patriot
    Im an American
    Im a person.

  22. Joe permalink
    September 25, 2011 7:17 am

    I have for almost 30 years served MY America & I know close up how violent, deadly and corrupt this mega-cult is. I laud Rep. Agema for his clarity, courage and service to his constituency – of which the muslims are a tiny %. So, to Edavis, kswheeler, et.al, shut the fuck up. Stop pissing down our back & telling us it’s raining. By playing our PC & legality against us & hiding your dick-worshiping cult behind the word religion, you’re justifying (trying to) the rape, murder, humiliation of females – just like your Profit (not misspelled) modeled for you in the 14th centurey – & then sell it to my people as peaceful. How dare you. I am so damn tired of you & your islamofascist society that you’re trying to force down our throats. Lies, deception, intimidation, fear, murder: yeah, you’re peaceful alright. Stop insulting patriotic, intelligent Americans in these columns. We see it for what you are: bullshit.

  23. Mark permalink
    September 25, 2011 1:03 pm

    Edavis, I am thankful for Muslims who are patriotic Americans. Based on your explanation I would expect that you would be a supporter of Rep. Agema’s HB 4769 so that your freedoms in America would be protected regardless of any foreign law, including Sharia, from attempting to circumvent our Constitution. That is the real issue at hand. There is much evidence of hatred in several of these posts on both sides of this issue. Protecting freedom and our laws should not have anything to do with hatred.

  24. edavis permalink
    September 25, 2011 2:05 pm

    Mark thank you for at least a thought out response without hatred.

    My question to you is, what would the harm be for Muslims to refer to the sharia in domestic matters when the following criteria apply:

    1) Both parties desire it, without any coercion.

    2) It is a matter which both parties feel happier because they are able to achieve an outcome which they feel is the most fair as it is within their beliefs.

    3) It doesn’t contradict any prohibited practices of U.S. Law.

    That being said, I never thought about sharia in America before this bill was introduced to me. And I’m not on any type of quest to make this happen.

    For some reason this member of Government trying to introduce this bill is spending government money doing so, instead of focusing on the real problems at hand in the state of Michigan, which has one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. I think it’s time for out govt. to stop beating a non existent horse and start becoming creative in the approach they use for fixing the REAL issues effecting us.

  25. Mark permalink
    September 25, 2011 4:19 pm

    Edavis, point 1 is not a point since anyone in America must follow our laws. For example if a married couple wants a divorce they must do so according to the law and not make that determination on their own or in a court of law separate from Michigan or the state they live. Point 2 this legislation is not based on (religious) beliefs but on law. Islam does not separate state from religion, but the founding of America was to keep the state out of religion. An American Muslim is free to practice faith and religion but not Islamic law in America. This statement would be true of any world religion or cult. They can practice their faith as long as it does not break our laws. For example a cult that wants animal sacrifice is unlawful but that group can still pray to whatever spirit they choose.

    Point 3, an indepth study of our Constitution and Sharia will show they are not only incompatible but diametrically opposed.

    Lastly jobs are a real issue but not the only issue. Protecting our freedom as laid out in the Constitution is extremely important or we risk losing our country. Our military has shed their blood for our freedom not for our employment or for more jobs.

  26. September 27, 2011 8:58 pm

    Sharia Law has rules for Muslims to follow, such as the five pillars, that are relatively innocous. It also includes rule for how various folks are to be treated in this world, in the most secular manner. These rules are all based on the Qur’an (the literal word of Allah), the Hadith (the statements and actions of the prophet of Islam, Muhammad, his companions, and the four first (rightfu) caliphs), the Sira (the first record of what Muhammad did as well as what he said), all encapsulated in Islamic Jurisprudence from the 9th century, which froze all the rules from the 7th century Arabia.

    The difficulty is which parts of Allah’s and Muhammads secular rules will Muslims live up to under Sharia, regarding how Muslim women are to be treated and ruled, and how non-Muslims are to be treated, including the frequirements for Jihad (holy war). For example, women, if they are raped, must find 4 male witnesses to testify in their behalf, or the case has no merit and will be thrown out. More women are in jail in Pakistan, under Sharia law, for “false” accusations of rape, i.e. they could not produce 4 male witnesses, than for any other reason.

    Christians and Jews, “people of the book”, are to pay a special tax, the Jizya, for the privilege of being allowed to continue to practice their religion, under strict rules, in an Islamic land, “with willing submission and believing themselves subdued” (Surah 9:29, from the final and concluding chapter of the Qur’an.

    Sharia law has nothing in common with American law and jurisprudence. Ontario and Quebec Provinces in Canada rejected Sharia after Muslim women objected to it, knowing how they would be treated as 2nd class citizens. Why are not our own American Muslim women objecting to it? Are they living in a fear society, as Sharia demands, only informally?

    Dave Agema is a true American hero. Everyone should support the AMerican Law for American Courts.

  27. anonymous permalink
    September 27, 2011 9:23 pm

    DNA evidence is now being used in most modern muslim countries to combat sexual assault. In places like Pakistan where they still follow many backwards practices this is true, they also on the same hand have one of the most corrupt countries in the world.

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